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Witty Ranter #1
Mon, 21 Jan 2008 02:21:00 GMT [download/play]

In his inaugural debut to the VirginWorlds Collective, Adam gets Brenden from AnotherHere, Michael Edwards, a MMO game developer, Michael Zenke from and Jonathan from The Online Gamer's Anthology together for a discussion.  Topics include "Crafting in MMO's:  It really need to die.  No, we mean it!", and "Is there anything in 2008 for us to look forward to?"... Oh yeah, and true to form, we get a Zenke Rant...  Aww yeah.  This show does contain explicit language.  Viewer Discretion Advised.
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Episode 1 Discussion Thread

'Crafting expanded.' by Nosferum
Submitted on 2008-01-21 18:03:35 CST
---The word "crafting" is too vague to debate, really. A more holistic understanding of crafting systems would be to include what spheres of game-play crafting affects as well. For example, in UO (1997), crafting expanded all spheres of play; from combat (PvE & PvP) to mini games (house decoration was a way of showing off). Everquest, as an exclusively PvE game (effectively, PvP was moot), had a form of crafting that was nothing more than an extension of PvE. Since then, most games have done the same. THIS is the "crafting" most gamers know.

---Next, all of the arguments I heard against crafting in general was. "I, personally, don't enjoy it." Apparently, there are many people who do.

'DAOC crafting' by jtravers
Submitted on 2008-01-22 03:43:23 CST
Honestly, I didn't find the comments against crafting to be compelling at all. I will say up front, I am not a huge fan of crafting myself. The last crafting I was involved heavily in was Dark Age of Camelot. The crafting could get quite boring and tedious. I do believe it was actually quite useful in many areas of the actual gameplay. The main thing was for me, money. Which is a good thing to have, and getting said money, could be fun because then you can buy stuff. Not being dependent on others to support you in a game, is big for me. It also enables you to help other players and enhance their gameplay as well. Useful items in fact, did exist in DAOC, and could greatly enhance your character.

- Salvaging. Big money. Money good. Items from Darkness Falls pvp dungeon, salvaged, for good money.
- Fletching. Bows. Arrows. Useful as a archer. Staves etc for the spellcrafting era.
- Armor. Useful. Everyone needed it. See Spellcrafting.
- Alchemy. Everyone wants dyes. Assassins need poison.

I could go on. I think that although there was a big time investment. The products of that time investment, did help you through the leveling process and were very useful in PvP and mandatory for a time. Until a particular expansion came out and changed the player crafting focus.

- Jon T.

'perfect' by LealaTurkey
Submitted on 2008-01-25 23:22:43 CST
Zenke Rant = Perfect.


'I call BS!' by Beauturkey
Submitted on 2008-01-26 01:34:54 CST
Ok, I'm going to use this term. I'm going to type it.
"I call BS" = FTW.
Ok I feel a lil sick.
Great show guys!!

'Great first show ' by AlikSteel
Submitted on 2008-01-29 12:15:20 CST
not going to get into it on here there are blogs for it. Craft could be used so much better than it is now. puting it in to all spheres .... like I said need blog space for this.
any way it was a great first show. and I can't wait till the next show

'Great first show...but I still love crafting' by Isanox
Submitted on 2008-01-29 16:18:45 CST
Yes, I am one of those odd balls who likes crafting.

Why? Well I made a post about it on my blog titled "Not everyone gets to be an astronaut when they grow up"

The one knock about it the show is, where are the rants?
I mean an all out flame like Lum's back on VW #29

'Where's the rant?' by trollonfire
Submitted on 2008-01-31 17:38:08 CST
Isanox, I point you to Zenke's little tirade about "Pining for Pre-Tramil UO days"... if that's not a rant, i dunno what is. And you can't burn too brightly as a flame, or you'll burn out! The rants will come, don't worry. I think the topics for the next couple of shows will definitely be rant-worthy material

'The practical gamer's reason for crafting...' by Extremefajita
Submitted on 2008-02-01 17:38:25 CST
I craft in EQ2. I like saving money and being self-sufficient. I make all my own food/drink, larger backpacks to hold loot for long trips, strong boxes so each character has 256 bankslots, all my Adept III spell upgrades, poisons for my Brigand, invis totems for my non-stealthy toons, various potions, jewelry etc. I occasionally buy armor when mine is way outgrown, but I would make that too if I had another character slot. When I played UO I made a character who never used a bank or went to a town...just crafted everything and used loot from adventuring. I prefer to make stuff myself and save money...I think the time investment is worth it...maybe not when they had all those sub-combines but now it's much less time-consuming. Create a druid who can hop around quickly and give him some crafting tools that speed up the harvesting and you can grab the raws and make the items you need in minutes.

'Missing example' by BeowolfSchaefer
Submitted on 2008-05-19 14:08:09 CST
Hi guys. I'm just catching up on old eps and I just finished listening to this one. I have to say as an avid EvE player I really found it sad that it was never mentioned in either of your discussions. Crafting in eve is an essential element of the world. It brings depth to the world when you know the hip you are flying someone in the world must have created. As far as just having something to do that isnt combat eve seems to have some plans for this in their new ambulation update that is on the way.

In addition, I also think in your second discussion eve would have been a good example of an alternative to the type of game you and I have become so jaded about.

Anyway maybe you guys should take a look, otherwise great show, very interesting. Please keep it up!