VirginWorlds.com - Exploring Massively Multiplayer Games

Shut Up. We're Talking.
Host: Darren and Karen
Darren and Karen present this commentary podcast covering recent topics found within the MMORPG Blogging and Podcasting community.

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Wilhelm2451

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Shut Up. We're Talking #41
Mon, 26 Jan 2009 01:55:00 GMT [download/play]

Introductions

Listener mail/What we're playing

Reduced MMO Spending in 09?

Killing the Executive Gamer

Blog of the Week

Hosts:

Darren - Commonsensegamer.com

Karen - Journey's with Jaye

John - Ancient Gaming Noob

Shawn - Massively

Topics:

Will you reduce spending

Value First

Executive Gamer

Blog of the Week:

Complete Heal

Previous Episodes
Episode #77 - Duration: 2925 - Released: Wed, 13 Jul 2011 06:16:01 +0000
Episode #76 - Duration: 7730 - Released: Sun, 30 Jan 2011 19:34:01 +0000
Episode #75 - Duration: 4659 - Released: Sun, 12 Dec 2010 17:57:48 +0000
Episode #74 - Duration: 4071 - Released: Sun, 21 Nov 2010 20:22:45 +0000
Episode #73 - Duration: 4943 - Released: Sun, 07 Nov 2010 19:41:07 +0000
Episode #72 - Duration: 4707 - Released: Sun, 17 Oct 2010 18:28:52 +0000
Episode #71 - Duration: 3820 - Released: Sun, 26 Sep 2010 16:39:28 +0000
Episode #70 - Duration: 4623 - Released: Sun, 12 Sep 2010 15:51:32 +0000
Episode #69 - Duration: 4837 - Released: Sun, 29 Aug 2010 18:07:07 +0000
Episode #68 - Duration: 01:13:32 - Released: Sun, 15 Aug 2010 15:34:00 GMT
Episode #67 - Duration: 01:12:09 - Released: Sun, 18 Jul 2010 14:24:00 GMT
Episode #66 - Duration: 00:59:30 - Released: Mon, 5 Jul 2010 23:26:00 GMT
Episode #65 - Duration: 01:23:43 - Released: Sun, 20 Jun 2010 16:03:00 GMT
Episode #64 - Duration: - Released: Sun, 6 Jun 2010 15:51:00 GMT
Episode #63 - Duration: 01:13:26 - Released: Sun, 16 May 2010 17:52:00 GMT
Episode #62 - Duration: 01:12:04 - Released: Thu, 6 May 2010 23:28:00 GMT
Episode #61 - Duration: 01:26:12 - Released: Fri, 16 Apr 2010 01:26:00 GMT
Episode #60 - Duration: 01:57:27 - Released: Tue, 30 Mar 2010 23:34:00 GMT
Episode #59 - Duration: 01:37:24 - Released: Mon, 1 Mar 2010 03:48:00 GMT
Episode #58 - Duration: 01:21:01 - Released: Sun, 14 Feb 2010 18:45:00 GMT
Episode #57 - Duration: 01:47:46 - Released: Mon, 1 Feb 2010 19:01:00 GMT
Episode #56.5 - Duration: 00:02:21 - Released: Wed, 20 Jan 2010 12:26:00 GMT
Episode #56 - Duration: 01:01:53 - Released: Mon, 16 Nov 2009 19:41:00 GMT
Episode #55 - Duration: 01:16:27 - Released: Tue, 20 Oct 2009 02:31:00 GMT
Episode #54 - Duration: 01:14:25 - Released: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 01:51:00 GMT
Episode #53 - Duration: 01:31:47 - Released: Tue, 8 Sep 2009 04:12:00 GMT
Episode #52.5 - Duration: 00:04:12 - Released: Wed, 2 Sep 2009 19:43:00 GMT
Episode #52 - Duration: 01:04:24 - Released: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 16:35:00 GMT
Episode #51 - Duration: 01:17:30 - Released: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 23:49:00 GMT
Episode #50 - Duration: 01:35:33 - Released: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 16:15:00 GMT
Episode #49 - Duration: 01:03:31 - Released: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 21:27:00 GMT
Episode #48 - Duration: 01:13:44 - Released: Thu, 4 Jun 2009 15:25:00 GMT
Episode #47 - Duration: 01:10:07 - Released: Sun, 10 May 2009 21:21:00 GMT
Episode #46 - Duration: 01:27:11 - Released: Mon, 4 May 2009 02:05:00 GMT
Episode #45 - Duration: 01:04:36 - Released: Mon, 13 Apr 2009 20:01:00 GMT
Episode #44 - Duration: 00:56:47 - Released: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 16:15:00 GMT
Episode #43.1 - Duration: 00:18:59 - Released: Mon, 9 Mar 2009 20:11:00 GMT
Episode #43 - Duration: 00:59:34 - Released: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 01:24:00 GMT
Episode #42 - Duration: 01:11:28 - Released: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 15:14:00 GMT
Episode #41 - Duration: 01:06:59 - Released: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 01:55:00 GMT
Episode #40.5 - Duration: 00:02:50 - Released: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 17:48:00 GMT
Episode #40 - Duration: 01:16:52 - Released: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 02:45:00 GMT
Episode #39 - Duration: 01:08:43 - Released: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 06:01:00 GMT
Episode #38 - Duration: 00:37:38 - Released: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 05:49:00 GMT
Episode #37 - Duration: - Released: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 17:26:00 GMT
Episode #36 - Duration: 01:10:59 - Released: Mon, 3 Nov 2008 03:03:00 GMT
Episode #35 - Duration: 00:49:08 - Released: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 22:54:00 GMT
Episode #34 - Duration: 01:08:50 - Released: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 19:38:00 GMT
Episode #33 - Duration: 00:58:54 - Released: Mon, 8 Sep 2008 01:42:00 GMT
Episode #32 - Duration: 01:03:27 - Released: Sun, 24 Aug 2008 19:01:00 GMT
Episode #31 - Duration: 01:05:03 - Released: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 20:13:00 GMT
Episode #30 - Duration: 00:59:20 - Released: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 00:44:00 GMT
Episode #29 - Duration: 00:28:31 - Released: Sat, 28 Jun 2008 13:48:00 GMT
Episode #28 - Duration: 01:09:13 - Released: Sun, 15 Jun 2008 19:31:00 GMT
Episode #27 - Duration: 01:14:25 - Released: Mon, 2 Jun 2008 02:42:00 GMT
Episode #26 - Duration: 01:06:47 - Released: Mon, 19 May 2008 03:10:00 GMT
Episode #25 - Duration: 01:01:48 - Released: Mon, 28 Apr 2008 01:46:00 GMT
Episode #24 - Duration: 00:57:48 - Released: Mon, 14 Apr 2008 00:00:00 GMT
Episode #23 - Duration: 00:47:54 - Released: Mon, 31 Mar 2008 01:05:00 GMT
Episode #22 - Duration: 01:12:16 - Released: Mon, 17 Mar 2008 04:54:00 GMT
Episode #21 - Duration: 01:56:55 - Released: Fri, 7 Mar 2008 05:01:00 GMT
Episode #20 - Duration: 00:49:01 - Released: Mon, 18 Feb 2008 04:08:00 GMT
Episode #19 - Duration: 01:01:05 - Released: Sun, 3 Feb 2008 05:08:00 GMT
Episode #18 - Duration: 01:08:01 - Released: Mon, 21 Jan 2008 02:35:00 GMT
Episode #17 - Duration: 01:36:26 - Released: Mon, 7 Jan 2008 04:07:00 GMT
Episode #16 - Duration: 01:06:39 - Released: Mon, 24 Dec 2007 15:58:00 GMT
Episode #15 - Duration: 01:33:23 - Released: Mon, 10 Dec 2007 01:24:00 GMT
Episode #14 - Duration: 01:24:15 - Released: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 07:47:00 GMT
Episode #13 - Duration: 01:22:18 - Released: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 01:30:00 GMT
Episode #12 - Duration: 01:17:38 - Released: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 16:55:00 GMT
Episode #11 - Duration: 01:17:01 - Released: Mon, 15 Oct 2007 03:30:00 GMT
Episode #10 - Duration: 01:00:37 - Released: Mon, 1 Oct 2007 03:33:00 GMT
Episode #9 - Duration: 01:12:13 - Released: Mon, 17 Sep 2007 04:47:00 GMT
Episode #8 - Duration: 01:24:35 - Released: Tue, 4 Sep 2007 02:44:00 GMT
Episode #7 - Duration: 01:11:21 - Released: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 04:05:00 GMT
Episode #6 - Duration: 01:10:07 - Released: Mon, 6 Aug 2007 01:13:00 GMT
Episode #5 - Duration: 00:58:57 - Released: Mon, 23 Jul 2007 01:50:00 GMT
Episode #4 - Duration: 01:13:04 - Released: Mon, 9 Jul 2007 03:52:00 GMT
Episode #3 - Duration: 01:10:25 - Released: Sun, 24 Jun 2007 17:20:00 GMT
Episode #2 - Duration: 01:09:48 - Released: Wed, 6 Jun 2007 05:20:00 GMT
Episode #1 - Duration: 01:08:21 - Released: Mon, 28 May 2007 02:12:00 GMT

Episode 41 Discussion Thread

'No Bartle Hate' by Wilhelm2451

Submitted on 2009-01-26 06:13:06 CST
I do want to point out that I do not hate Dr. Richard Bartle and that the out take where Karen says that I do is clipped before I can respond and point out that I respect him and the work he has done, but that I feel a lot of gamers do not get where he is coming from. He is the guy with the ultimate executive gamer issue, which is where he came up during the show.

I do admit however that in the past I have used comments about him to incite Mr. Zenke into minor rants for my own amusement.

'Man Love...' by darrenl

Submitted on 2009-01-26 11:44:18 CST
...for Bartle was fully expressed by Mr.Wilhelm after said clip.

Flowers were sent. Wine was drunk. Barry Manalo was playing.

'Executive Gaming' by SaraPickell

Submitted on 2009-01-26 15:27:32 CST
I have to admit to being an executive gamer myself. Personally, I'd rather not put the blinders back on and try to be, among other things, a monogamous gamer. While I'm sure that within a particular game not having that executive gamer in me would make the experience generally more simply enjoyable, I have other issues to think about as well.

For one, I really don't want to walk away from a game without something of lasting value to me. As well though, since I do hope to break into the industry at some point, it's much more valuable for me to be able to place the entire thing in the framework of a larger body of experience, and accurately critique it.

'Executive wut?' by CindyL

Submitted on 2009-01-26 22:21:31 CST
I have to admit 'executive' gamers, blogs and editorials I don't tend to pay any attention to unless they have a unique style of writing or have an unusual perspective. Otherwise they all seem to always say the same thing and examine in excruciating detail mechanics and other 'dry' topics that usually don't interest me to begin with. :)

Since the economic crisis has hit the proverbial fan in these past months I've found myself minimizing my MMOs to the point of not even being subbed to any P2P ones. My husband who was playing LotrO and CoH has also let go of these games and doesn't seem too eager to jump back in. I'm not really sure what that says about our future gaming other then maybe we'll be more savvy about picking games we can play together and only spend money where we can both play together. Goes right along with the point Karen was saying about people being mindful of playing the games their friends or associations play.

I also wouldn't give up on online gaming completely ever because as said on the show it is the cheapest, most fun imo, type of entertainment and hobby around. And it does create a social network in a town where I normally would not meet very many like minded people.

'Eve Scandals' by TranquilAbyss
Submitted on 2009-01-27 01:08:57 CST
With eve you got to remembers it is a make up of 3 games in one.

-You have the industrial group who where most effected by the latest POS scandal.

-Then there is the PVP people who where get affected by a different part of the game, such as the speed nerf.

-Mission Runners are only angry when their favorite ship can not do level 4 missions.

-You also have to think of High sec to Low sec progression of a corporation and how each problem affects the types of solar systems in eve.

Each play style normally only feels the affect that targets their play style.

With the current banning of the players taking part in the billion isk POS scam, it raised the prices of materiel to build Tech 2 components. For Industrialist that means we just recalculate our profits decide if we will produce the item or not. PVP and mission runners have to pay the increased cost of the item. And life goes on.

So in a sense we are each gaming style is disconnected from each others pain, and will absorb the damages and keep going.

'CCP Controversy' by Barua
Submitted on 2009-01-29 04:52:29 CST
As Karen brought up early in the show, CCPs EvE Online indeed had and continues to have its share of scandals. And its players continue to tolerate it, but I don't believe it's because of any game investment or because "what else is there?".

I believe us EvE players tolerate it for two reasons. One because CCP puts so much effort into getting involved with the playerbase. Unlike other games where the devs are up high in their ivory tower oblivious to their customers, CCP really tries to get our input on the game. It's rather common to have a one-on-one chat with a CCP dev who genuinely wants to know what average Joe Gamer thinks about the game.

CCP even hosts semi regular get-together parties over in Iceland, along with the CSM program (Council of Steller Management). I think it's that bridge between devs and players which makes forgiving CCP for these scandals so easy. It's the human factor.

The second reason I believe is because CCP is very honest and upfront with us players. In other MMOs, when a scandal or a gamebreaking mistake is introduced in the game, their devs will say something along the lines of "Working as Intended"".

With CCP, they come right out and say what their intentions were with X, how it turned out, and what they're going to try to remedy the situation. It's that kind of honesty that really shows that they're aware of the problem and player concerns and are not afraid to face up to them.

'CCP Controversy' by Barua
Submitted on 2009-01-29 05:48:57 CST
As Karen brought up early in the show, CCPs EvE Online indeed had and continues to have its share of scandals. And its players continue to tolerate it, but I don't believe it's because of any game investment or because "what else is there?".

I believe us EvE players tolerate it for two reasons. One because CCP puts so much effort into getting involved with the playerbase. Unlike other games where the devs are up high in their ivory tower oblivious to their customers, CCP really tries to get our input on the game. It's rather common to have a one-on-one chat with a CCP dev who genuinely wants to know what average Joe Gamer thinks about the game.

CCP even hosts semi regular get-together parties over in Iceland, along with the CSM program (Council of Steller Management). I think it's that bridge between devs and players which makes forgiving CCP for these scandals so easy. It's the human factor.

The second reason I believe is because CCP is very honest and upfront with us players. In other MMOs, when a scandal or a gamebreaking mistake is introduced in the game, their devs will say something along the lines of "Working as Intended"".

With CCP, they come right out and say what their intentions were with X, how it turned out, and what they're going to try to remedy the situation. It's that kind of honesty that really shows that they're aware of the problem and player concerns and are not afraid to face up to them.

'The lost VirginWorlds podcast?' by jasoneth
Submitted on 2009-01-29 19:27:36 CST
Darren mentioned a podcast last week with Brent; was this a soon-to-be-released episode of the sorely-missed VirginWorlds MMORPG News? If there was one show I thought would never podfade, that'd be it, but the dearth of new shows is giving me doubts.

I may have imagined it, but it seems that when Darren explicitly asked Shawn what he was playing, John immediately answered...

'Stepped on Shawn?' by Wilhelm2451

Submitted on 2009-01-30 02:10:02 CST
I was just enforcing the "age before beauty" rules.

At some point in the past I guessed Brent was going to start podfading when his daughter reached a certain age. We might have reached that age.